Is work permit needed for independent artist?

[MoBry]

I've heard about what you need to establish a business but someone mentioned that if you're an artist working from home, you don't need a work permit. Anyone know for sure what the situation is as I'm a digital artist creating art at home.

[karmels]

MoBry.
I think if you intend to sell these painting / drawings a work permit will be required.
Working from home does not exclude you from these laws as you are making a profit with out paying the local taxes, vat, ect.

[MoBry]

Okay, thanks for the prompt response, Karmels.

[Keithcaley]

The full requirements are stated here, and include the warning: "It is only legal to work if someone holds a valid work or business permit" - this is regardless of whether they are being paid, or not, or even working for a registered charity (with certain very specific exceptions)

[surfmeetseast]

Further to this, I am a portrait artist, currently not working but thinking of setting up a Facebook site showing my work. If I were to sell internationally, would this be illegal?
I live here full time, we have kocan on our house, but I do not yet have residency
Any help gratefully received

[surfmeetseast]

Thanks for the pm Keith, I had read it. I guess the only thing to do is speak to the appropriate body.
Oh and I AM a bit deaf as it happens

[Marions]

Suggest you speak to the Labour Department, Kyrenia District or pop in there - the offices next to the Hospital . I don't think much has changed from a meeting I and several others, of course, attended a few years back when they tried to clarify the position for foreigners. There was a sheet of paper with 23 Q & A's on to help. Things may have changed but I doubt it. However, one thing that was said (not on the sheet) was that working via the internet was a separate issue.

However, why not take a look at the web page (hope that has not changed0 http://www.calisma.gov .ct.tr or phone Ministry of Labour 0392 227 3643 or Labour Department in Kyrenia District Office 0392 815 21 12, but suggest you have a Turkish speaking person with you

Hope you find your answers.

(oh and by the way, the sheet of Q & A's was a bit complicated, as some of the answers to questions were referral to other departments of the Government.)

[surfmeetseast]

Thanks for that Marion, v helpful. What I had hope to do was sell my work abroad, not here necessarily although I would love to donate something to animal charities here. All I would be doing is working at home, and not reaching anything like a taxable income by EU standards, but it seems fraught with complications! Should have kept my mouth shut really

[Marions]

I would have thought that Internet and selling abroad is quite ok .what The government didn't seem to want is anyone taking away jobs from locals. The same spied when I worked in the south before it wad European. Them it was 'work permit or deportation. '
Another possibility for anyone is the markets. It seems ok top have a stall and sell your wares but of course that limits number of potential customers
But as I say what you are proposing sounds as if it comes within the 'work over the internet'which I was told is ok
good luck.

[karmels]

Marions.
Producing something in the TRNC and selling via the internet could be seen as a off shore company and would have to be registered and taxes payed, imho.

[Johnny Lee]

I would have thought that internet selling abroad would be perfectly legal.

I help to run my business in the UK from here via internet phone D.H.L. etc. etc. Many many people here deal with their business and work via internet here.

This part time work situation is joke, I want to sing and entertain occasionally I am not reliant on the money. Other people want to continue their hobbies and maybe get a few quid towards their costs.

Yet there are market stalls week in week out with people earning a lot of money, ???

It all needs sorting but I doubt it will in our life time.

[karmels]

Johnnylee I did say PRODUCED in the TRNC??? then sold on the internet.

[Johnny Lee]

OK Karmels, fair comment so where do the 100s of people selling on markets here produce their items ??

Seems to be one law for one and one for another ??

[Keithcaley]

Lee, I remember when the Minister concerned was asked about people selling stuff at Markets, his response was "We are not concerned with a few pensioners selling their second hand goods at Markets" - and that is his perception of the 'Market' business.

The fact that he doesn't have a clue is irelevant, he is the one who directs where attention should be focused, and so it is...

That does not mean that if some hapless individual, earning a few coppers is apprehended for infringing the labour laws, they won't throw the book at them!

[Johnny Lee]

Yes Kieth, but we all know many of the traders make their living from it , Don't get me wrong I have no issues what so ever, I believe in live and let live, providing you are not hurting anyone or really stepping out of line.

Life's too short, I have about 9,000 hours left if I am very lucky. We only have around 76,000 hours from the day we come into this world (if we live to a good average age.)

I was just responding to Karmels post.

Have a great day and make the most of those remaining hours.

[waddo]

Bang goes eBay then - or maybe not???? I make mouse head protectors out of used almond shells and sell them on eBay, do I need to register this as a business as the almond grows on my tree in the garden so is "produced in the TRNC" but I only sell them part time.

If it can be seen to be illegal or you are going to make money out of something that nobody else has thought of doing then you can almost guarantee that you will need a license to do it here!

[Keithcaley]

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. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . MEMO to self: . . . . . . . . . . "Must get out more" . . . .

[jofra]

"We only have around 76,000 hours ....."
I do hope you mean 760,000 hours.... Otherwise I'm well past the (approx) eight and a half years....

[karmels]

Johnny Lee.
I remember in another thread you had a meeting with a minister of works about entertaining, you mentioned to the minister about the expats selling at the different markets.
To me you have an issue with this and it is not a case of live and let live.

[Marions]

As I said earlier, none of us can provide the answers - only what we have heard and read, but as I suggested, it might be better to tlak to the Government office(s) concerned to find out.

Maybe they will tlel different stories one form the other, but where the law of this land is concerned, only they will really tall you.

I think it is pretty widely recognized that laws change swiftly - some get re-enforced and then followed by laxity et,c etc. But 'horses mouth' is best to find out what the CURRENT situation is.

[Keithcaley]

...I have about 9,000 hours left if I am very lucky...

OMG! - just over a year!

(Thanks to jofra for spotting it!)

[surfmeetseast]

Thanks to Mobry for starting this post, sorry I hijacked it ! Than Johnny Lee for positive remarks and Marion's for your practicalcal and knowledgeable help as for the rest , Andrews sisters, eliminate the negative

[surfmeetseast]

Oh Waddo u r so funny love you posts

[Johnny Lee]

Sorry yes I missed a zero off my calculations.

Karmels I do not recall saying anything about markets ? It was simply something I pointed our today .

I have no issues with anyone, except hypocrites who make out they are whiter than white Please note I am not referring to you I do not even know who you are, or even if you sell on markets.

I have no issues what so ever, I believe that petty rules are there to be broken and I have broken many many of them in my time.

I am far from perfect.

If anyone can honestly say that they have never done a naughty in their life than I take my hat off to them.

I have worked the taxman and the VAT man, Banks, Insurance companies. etc etc to my advantage as often as possible in my business life in the UK.

I come from an era when we did jobs on the side, cooked the books, etc.etc, Cash was king and everyone including the customer was looking for the best deal. This Is Life.

[surfmeetseast]

I am not whiter than white either, I was trying to find out, as Mobry was, how to go about things without putting my family into jeopardy by breaking laws.
I don't need to sit at Lambousa as my work is all pre commissioned, that is not my issue. Looking at Keith's and Marions helpful links has made me more confused though as nothing seems to apply to what I would like to do. I think an in person visit is the only answer, but dreading it

[Johnny Lee]

Karmels can you please verify your statement about my meeting with the minister of works please and my comment. I have only ever been to one meeting and I have just looked back through the minutes of that meeting and I did not mention markets.

In fact I spoke twice once about raising money for genuine good causes and once about part time work.

[Johnny Lee]

Surfmeetseast good luck with your venture, but the fact is that there are many superb artists here as I am sure you are and I do not not know a single one who is doing it legally.

[surfmeetseast]

Thanks Johnny, during the course of this thread I have come to realise that, and think that word of mouth and no publicity is the only way to go. I do not need the money either, just want a peaceful life doing what I like doing

[Lottidotti]

Jonny Lee,reference your post #24 last two paragraphs,You aren't from Greece are you? 'Cooking the books,working the taxman,VAT man,banks ,insurance companies,any other fiddles you have forgotten.

[MoBry]

Having read all the comments (and thanks for all the comments along the highways and by-ways!) , I shan't bother selling here, better to be safe than sorry. I can sell over the internet which is a lot easier, I ugess. What I'd hoped to do with with my digital art was sell it for display in new homes, etc., but it's really not worthwhile the cost of setting up as a business. Hey-ho, back to cuddling my dogs!!!

[surfmeetseast]

Mobrey there are some good websites where you can open your own shop and sell your digital art. They are quite cheap, fairly easy to manage, please pm me if you would like some linkms

[Johnny Lee]

LottiDotti spent many happy hours in Greece and the islands , (at the expense of the Taxman etc.) ha. ha. But no 100% English. I just did what was needed to be done to survive in business and pay the bills and the staff.

I have and still are paying thousands in UK tax and Vat .

I am also still waiting for Karmels to verify his or her statement, I find that very wrong making unless you are 100 % certain.

[karmels]

Johnny Lee.
I have just lost a long post I sent you.
But in short you mentioned the minister not caring about expats selling their old close, so you must have an issue with these markets as you have to pay when you entertain.
I am not going to get involved any further in this a I am on your side, if you can work under the radar fine but like you I paid taxes here for over 15 years, we are now retired. I do not get a pension from the TRNC as they changed the rules but we get free medical for life as a retired couple with TRNC Kimlik cards.
I am sorry for not replying but we are in Turkey and have been in Anlanya shopping, I left the computer on to download a program.

[Keithcaley]

...you mentioned the minister not caring about expats selling their old close...

Mel, I think that it was me that mentioned the minister's (reported) comments - not Johnny Lee!

I know that it's easy to lose track on some of these rambling threads - I've done it myself...

However, you may have unjustly accused poor 'Lee'

[Johnny Lee]

Kieth you are an absolute Gent.

I knew I had not said it. I hold no malice to Karmels, the man who never made a mistake never did anything. (England's Glory Matchbox)

I wish Karmels a good holiday.

Thank You Kieth.

[karmels]

John lee, I apologize for that statement, hope you get everything sorted.

[Johnny Lee]

No problem Karmels it takes a big man to apologise have fun in Turkey. Regards Lee

[Johnny Lee]

Things here will never be sorted I have to charity appearances soon for children s charity's , something close to my heart and if small minded nasty people want to have a pop at me for this then bring it on .