New system at crossing points

Deniz1 · Post by **Deniz1** » Fri 15 May 2015 11:47 am

According to Kibrispostasi.com you no longer have a white paper to be stamped if you are not cypriot.Remain in your car and show id. Starting today.

Hedge-fund · Post by **Hedge-fund** » Fri 15 May 2015 11:54 am

I'm crossing South to North on Sunday so will let you know what happens in practice.

Translation from website reads:-

"Turkish Cypriot side lifted the visa stamp paper application in transition.

In the transition to vehicles with new applications will no longer be descended from the vehicle.

The new method was implemented as of this morning."

Confidence building measure?

Belfast Belle · Post by **Belfast Belle** » Fri 15 May 2015 12:23 pm

Does this mean I wonder the end to the 90 days loop hole.

Deniz1 · Post by **Deniz1** » Fri 15 May 2015 12:30 pm

Possibly as there is no white paper and assuming they dont stamp your passport ?

frontalman · Post by **frontalman** » Fri 15 May 2015 2:07 pm

Sounds to me like a more relaxed state of affairs whereby if you are entitled to be on one side, then that will be good enough for the other. We shall see.

Belfast Belle · Post by **Belfast Belle** » Fri 15 May 2015 2:26 pm

In the Cyprus News today it states Greek Cypriots only.

Belfast Belle · Post by **Belfast Belle** » Fri 15 May 2015 2:30 pm

Greek Cypriots will no longer need to fill in a ‘visa’ to cross to the breakaway northern Cyprus

ttoli · Post by **ttoli** » Fri 15 May 2015 2:31 pm

http://cyprus-mail.com/2015/05/15/no-mo ... s-reports/

TRNCVaughan · Post by **TRNCVaughan** » Fri 15 May 2015 2:44 pm

Is this our new Pres putting the GC's on the back foot?
Wonder what we get in return?

frontalman · Post by **frontalman** » Fri 15 May 2015 3:54 pm

Someone in the Cyprus Mail online said that he crossed back and forth with a UK passport and didn't need a visa slip, so it isn't just Greek Cypriots. Wouldn't try it with a Syrian one though.

PoshinDevon · Post by **PoshinDevon** » Fri 15 May 2015 4:26 pm

Hmmmm......interesting development.

My understanding was the white paper that you could fill in on arrival at Ercan or when crossing from south to north was optional........the reason being that you would then have TRNC arrival/exit stamps on the paper as opposed to in your passport....if you wanted. This was to prevent quizzing most notably by the greek Cypriot side or possibly when visiting Greece or maybe other countries, who may ask questions about having these stamps in your passport.

Can understand the lifting for those crossing with a Cyprus passport but crossing on UK passport but no white visa paper with TRNC arrival/exit stamp or TRNC stamp in passport does seem strange and somewhat confusing with regards to the 90 days stay ruling. What happens about the extension beyond 90 days that is supposedly needed to remain legal and stay up to 1 or 2 years...blood tests etcetc......cannot really see the TRNC suddenly giving up this source of income. Maybe they just check and record your arrival/exit and e pect you to remember how long you have stayed....if you exceed the 90 days then relevant fine imposed?

Definately needs clarifying as confusion will undoubtably reign!

come_on_aylin · Post by **come_on_aylin** » Fri 15 May 2015 4:35 pm

We crossed over this afternoon, on way out there was one line of traffic, the other lane was coned off, and one TC booth open. An official took our passports and visa slip from the car and handed them to the person in the booth. He checked them but did not stamp the slip. However, on return it was the same system as usual, i.e. get out the car, hand over passports and visa slip and get it stamped.

Helvetia · Post by **Helvetia** » Fri 15 May 2015 6:31 pm

We crossed to the South early this morning. I got out of the car, went to the passport booth and got the white visa slip stamped as we have done for the past xxx years. Coming back at about midday there was chaos, with a lot of police around. After getting out of the car to go to the booth as I normally do, I was shouted at to go back to my car. When we reached the booth a very nice policeman took our passports from us while we remained In in the car and they were then processed. I really couldn't tell if the white visa slip was stamped or not as it is quite full and the stamps are not always very clear. Our passports were definitely not stamped though. It felt to us as if the police were looking for someone, although from reading this forum later, it may be a step towards reconciliation. Who knows?!

mrsgee · Post by **mrsgee** » Fri 15 May 2015 6:52 pm

I think there might be a bit of misinterpretation here......As someone touched on earlier....how does this then impact on the folk who choose not to take residency in TRNC but pop over the border and get the 90 days.....interesting is it not? We have always done residency, even though over 60, prefer to do it.....but always use the slip of paper simply to stop our passports getting filled up with stamping.

sophie · Post by **sophie** » Fri 15 May 2015 7:39 pm

There is an article in Cyprusscene under News-Events headed No More Paper Work at Crossing Points. May be me, but I can't see anything relevant re 90Day Residency thingy.

steve66 · Post by **steve66** » Sat 16 May 2015 5:03 am

I have just read this

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-32734971

Keithcaley · Post by **Keithcaley** » Sat 16 May 2015 5:16 am

For those who didn't read the BBC article mentioned in the previous post, it is really talking about the resumption of talks, and says: -

"In an initial move, Turkish Cypriot authorities agreed to no longer require Greek Cypriots to fill in visa forms at crossing points to northern Cyprus, UN envoy Mr Eide told reporters."

So if you're not a Greek Cypriot, it doesn't apply to you!

Kavenkoy · Post by **Kavenkoy** » Sat 16 May 2015 6:05 am

http://world.bgnnews.com/visas-no-longe ... aberi/6007

Keithcaley · Post by **Keithcaley** » Sat 16 May 2015 6:39 am

Kavenkoy wrote:http://world.bgnnews.com/visas-no-longe ... aberi/6007

A conflicting version then!

Briannu · Post by **Briannu** » Sat 16 May 2015 6:54 am

Last night went to Larnaca via Beyarmudu and my white slip was was duly stamped. Came back through Mehetan and my white slip wasn't stamped when I asked why the Border Police said "no stamp" . Very confusing but maybe because I am over 65

sophie · Post by **sophie** » Sat 16 May 2015 7:01 am

Would you expect anything else Keith? Lets face it they can't even agree on what to call CHEESE!! I love living here (most of the time) and have learned that its extremely naïve of anyone to expect discussions to be anything else other that complex, conflicting, and complicate. Also to expect the Crossing police, Immigration and Uncle Tom Cobley to be singing off the same hymn sheet at the same time, is an impossibility. No-one has remarked on what is happening at Ercan!!?

Keithcaley · Post by **Keithcaley** » Sat 16 May 2015 7:05 am

Briannu wrote:Last night went to Larnaca via Beyarmudu and my white slip was was duly stamped. Came back through Mehetan and my white slip wasn't stamped when I asked why the Border Police said "no stamp" . Very confusing but maybe because I am over 65

I see that sophie has posted while I was typing - I agree!

Anyway, -

More likely reason is that the guy didn't really understand the new ruling.

This usually happens whenever there is any change to procedure, the people who have to actually do the job don't get properly briefed or trained, and the procedure is filtered down via Chinese Whispers

If you ask three different officials what the correct procedure is for any given issue, then you'll get three different answers!

teatime · Post by **teatime** » Sat 16 May 2015 7:51 am

As this ruling is only on the border between north and south Cyprus, surely the 90 day ruling will mean actually leaving the island to get a 90 day stamp. What will happen for people coming in via Larnaca wanting to stay more than 90 days? Yet again a politician making a rule that has implications that they haven't taken into consideration.

waddo · Post by **waddo** » Sat 16 May 2015 8:06 am

Hate to say things again people but the "Border" is not a "Border", it is a crossing point. Please remember that it is a “Crossing Point” on the Island of Cyprus (all of which is in the EU) between occupied and non-occupied territories of the RoC - as far as the law and politics (sorry to swear there) is concerned.
Once you get that bit straight in your mind and then add in the more confusing bits about EU citizenship (which you would need in the South if you lived there or stayed there beyond the legal visitor limit) as it should apply to the whole Island, if one part of it was not "occupied". Then add in the law as applied by the TRNC in regard to "Aliens" and "Visitors" - none of which have suffered radical change in the last 20 years - then you can make up your own story to fit your own requirements and just hope it works out in the end.
As Keith says there will be total confusion (no surprise there then) in the coming weeks/months until somebody in power has the courage to actually put it down on paper and sign it over a postage stamp! In the meanwhile “I” expect more checking/scanning of passports on entering/exiting non-occupied territory, white slip use or not on entering/exiting occupied territory and all in all – no real change apart from confusion on both sides.
The only thing that will change the whole issue is if there is a settlement and the occupied territory becomes unoccupied once more then EU law will apply everywhere. Why worry?

mrsgee · Post by **mrsgee** » Sat 16 May 2015 8:22 am

That was my point also, what happens with the folk who use the crossing to 'renew' their 90 day residency instead of doing temporary. I don't worry anyway cos even though over 60 I prefer to take temporary residency as I live here.....but I know lots of people use that loophole. Will they now have to a) leave the island and come back, or b) pay for temporary residency......interesting.

teatime · Post by **teatime** » Sat 16 May 2015 8:42 am

That old chestnut again! When is a border not a border?
Dictionary definition = The line or frontier area separating political divisions or geographic regions; a boundary
I'll make my own mind up what I call it.

ozankoys · Post by **ozankoys** » Sat 16 May 2015 8:49 am

If you are over 60 & take advantage of the maybe concession not to have residency then the 90 day rule is not really applicable. As far as I am aware you have to go to Turkey before you get another 90 days as crossing the border does not count, any days you have stayed since the initial 90 days were given are deducted & you get the balance written in.
But obviously as above depends who you see on the day & how they are feeling!

Keithcaley · Post by **Keithcaley** » Sat 16 May 2015 10:27 am

ozankoys wrote:If you are over 60 & take advantage of the maybe concession not to have residency then the 90 day rule is not really applicable. As far as I am aware you have to go to Turkey before you get another 90 days as crossing the border does not count, any days you have stayed since the initial 90 days were given are deducted & you get the balance written in.
But obviously as above depends who you see on the day & how they are feeling!

Hmmm...

That would mean that if leaving via a crossing point to the South, and flying from Larnaca to Australia for a month or two before returning - again, via Larnaca and a crossing point, could mean that you were counted as being 'here' for the whole time, and might even - technically - have overstayed your 90 days!

I don't think so!

ozankoys · Post by **ozankoys** » Sat 16 May 2015 10:50 am

Keith in such a case you could presumably take your boarding cards to immigration to prove where you were.

PoshinDevon · Post by **PoshinDevon** » Sat 16 May 2015 10:53 am

Now I know that its a newspaper but Cyprus Today reports that " people of any nationality crossing the border no longer have to fill in a visa form and get it stamped by immigration on entry and departure. Officials will simply look at passports and id cards and register on the computer system"

To me this indicates that there will be records kept of how long you stay in the TRNC...but you will not have a record/stamp to show exit/arrival dates. Therefore perphaps you are expected to keep your own mental note/record of how long you stay Stay over the 90 days without having started the visa extension process could prove expensive if you forget how long you have been in the TRNC.

As for popping across the crossing for a day or two and getting another 90 days who know. We crossed over 6 weeks ago after having been here 30 days to meet friends in the south, stayed a day came back and got another 90 days. Two weeks ago we popped home to UK via Larnaca for big birthday bash....came back 5 days later and again got 90 day stamp.

However being under 60 we had already applied for the visa extension as we wanted peace of mind, no surprises when crossing t and from south.

Whilst it is no doubt a confidence boosting move it sure is confusing. Of course the Cyprus Today paper may have got it wrong as well!

Hector · Post by **Hector** » Sat 16 May 2015 11:49 am

If you don't get your white visa form stamped, how will you know how many days you have? What happens if you leave but there is a mistake making the computer entry and the computer thinks you have remained in the TRNC in excess of your 90 days (as has happened) and they want to refuse you entry on your return or hit you with a huge fine?

PoshinDevon · Post by **PoshinDevon** » Sat 16 May 2015 12:50 pm

Just listened to news on Radio Bayrak whilst driving home.....lo and behold the confidence boosting measures were mentioned ......Bayrak reported that the white paper visa was no longer required for Turkish Cypriot nationals and would hopefully ease congestion at crossing points, especially for those ofboth sides that cross on a daily basis.

So as others have stated I think its a case of confusion reigns amongst the officials at crossing points who appear to be interpretting things in many different ways. Announcement made but no official written guidance disseminated down. Give it a month and things will be sorted wont they

PoshinDevon · Post by **PoshinDevon** » Sat 16 May 2015 1:45 pm

Sort of linked to this thread and Cyprus Today also reports the long awaited draft citizenship bill has been submitted to MPs for approval...this will set out the route for foreign residents to become TRNC citizens. Other measures include conditions relating to foreigners in the TRNC on work permits and also purchase of property.

Maybe the newly found enthusiasm for a solution to the Cyprus problem may move these issues along a little quicker.......ok maybe not! Its all been heard before. But who knows........if there was a solution all this residency, property purchase and working in the TRNC issues would surely have to change?

However I personally am not yet convinced a solution will happen or is for the best.

scubadubaqueen · Post by **scubadubaqueen** » Sun 17 May 2015 2:54 am

"http://world.bgnnews.com/visas-no-longe ... aberi/6007"

It certainly would be a confidence building move if it did apply to all EU Nationals.

As the holder of an EU Passport more often than not I just flash my passport on the Greek side and nobody records anything (all very relaxed), and yet when returning to the TRNC side (one feels tense!), albeit more often than not I am given 90 days, there have been occasions when this has not been the case, especially when travelling alone and not with my children, who apparently are not restricted on the amount of time they spend in the North, and so they can hardly give me 24 hours and the kids different. But the white paper is at least written evidence to me of how long or not I have got before heading to MacDonald's or the Cyprus Shopping Mall again.

Without clarification this announcement as it stands has created more problems than it has solved, with all the different interpretations! Not that I ever stay anything like 90 days before flitting over the border again, but it would be good to know if EU Nationals of any age, are no longer restricted on the amount of time that they can spend in the North as they are in the South, just as TCs and GCs holding EU Passports have no restrictions on the amount of time they can spend in any other EU country including the UK with free access to the NHS as well.

For me what is good for the goose is good for the gander!

Deniz1 · Post by **Deniz1** » Sun 17 May 2015 5:17 am

No free access to nhs if you have lived out of the country for a while.

tonyr · Post by **tonyr** » Sun 17 May 2015 7:19 am

What happens when you arrive via Ercan on EU passport. Is now same as arriving Larnaca? Anybody done this since changes?

waddo · Post by **waddo** » Sun 17 May 2015 7:28 am

On the off chance that all goes well and Cyprus becomes one Island in the EU and that both parts are recognized by the world - this may be of interest to you:

http://www.eurescyprus.eu/regulations-governing-eu.html

This may also answer some questions but then you will have to read it yourselves:

http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/

Whatever happens, change is coming and not only for Turkish Cypriots but for everyone else who currently lives here.

roadrunner · Post by **roadrunner** » Sun 17 May 2015 7:39 am

The British Residents Society will be seeking clarification early next week on a number of issues surrounding this announcement, including many raised on this forum.
Once this is done, it will be available on the BRS website at http://www.brstrnc.com

David Veasey

BRS Communications Secretary

White Lily · Post by **White Lily** » Sun 17 May 2015 8:58 am

Went through Metehan yesterday both ways - no white slip needed for any nationality. THAT is the only difference. Otherwise, records are kept on the computer as usual. It certainly made it easier without the holdups of people filling in new forms or getting them stamped. It will make things easier for tourists coming from the South at Arasta. Instead of having to bake in the hot sun while filling in forms, they can cross to the North quicker and enjoy their stay, rather than tell their friends not to bother because of the long queues.

You will need to make a note in your diary of when you come and go.

Deniz1 · Post by **Deniz1** » Sun 17 May 2015 10:55 am

Proving you have comprehensive health insurance may be a problem if you are over 70 many companies wont insure you then.

Kanonier · Post by **Kanonier** » Sun 17 May 2015 11:02 am

Interesting times ahead, especially if the United Kingdom votes to leave the European Union in the 2017 referendum.

TRNCVaughan · Post by **TRNCVaughan** » Sun 17 May 2015 1:03 pm

Went through today. TC's are getting waved through. Everyone else still has to proffer passport for details to be entered in computer. Passport then returned. Time saved?----2 seconds?
Greek cypriots now have a TC channel and everyone else goes through another channel for passport to be looked at. On return passport scanned causing back-ups.
Interestingly there is a new sign in the TC immigration window that says a 90 day visa will be granted on entry, failure to renew before expiry will attract a fine.

ifonly · Post by **ifonly** » Sun 17 May 2015 1:24 pm

We went to the South on Friday evening through Metehan. On TRNC - Roc white visa slip stamped as usual. On the way back a few hours later it was removed from our passports and put on a pile of many other white slips - our passport details were entered on the computer and returned to us . I asked about the visa slip and he told me " Finished - not needed any more".
Today we walked over at Locmaci - no white slips needed at all either way - they just entered our details on the computer. There was a long queue though coming back in as the Greek border police were scanning all non RoC passports.
I asked about the 90 day visa and was told that the entry information is held only on the computer and if someone overstays they will be fined on exit !!!!

Keithcaley · Post by **Keithcaley** » Sun 17 May 2015 1:27 pm

You couldn't make it up, could you?

waddo · Post by **waddo** » Sun 17 May 2015 3:39 pm

Seems simple enough to me, the interesting thing will be if crossing at a crossing point will now actually count as having left the country? If not then good luck to all those who have never bothered with residency - its much more expensive to fly back and forwards to Turkey every 90 days.

scubadubaqueen · Post by **scubadubaqueen** » Sun 17 May 2015 7:34 pm

Waddo that is not going to apply because if you leave through Larnaca the TRNC have no record of your leaving the island! And neither are EU Passport holders passports stamped, so it appears to me now that if there is a
"new sign in the TC immigration window that says a 90 day visa will be granted on entry, failure to renew before expiry will attract a fine."
Then as far as those who go back and forth are concerned, one does not have to worry any more about how many days you are given, because 90 days will be applied as the standard no matter how long you have been here, so in reality as long as you want providing you flit out South before the 90 days are up. So no more 30 days, 15 days, 24 hours in a worst case scenario! Which kind of makes sense given that they are doing away with the white visa slips, otherwise what physical proof do you have about the time you have been granted! Save confusion, 90 days for all, easy to remember, and leaves no margin for error!

Kavenkoy · Post by **Kavenkoy** » Sun 17 May 2015 7:55 pm

Kanonier wrote:Interesting times ahead, especially if the United Kingdom votes to leave the European Union in the 2017 referendum.

No chance we could not survive like or not we can't go on without the EU .

PoshinDevon · Post by **PoshinDevon** » Sun 17 May 2015 7:56 pm

scubadubaqueen wrote:Waddo that is not going to apply because if you leave through Larnaca the TRNC have no record of your leaving the island! And neither are EU Passport holders passports stamped, so it appears to me now that if there is a
"new sign in the TC immigration window that says a 90 day visa will be granted on entry, failure to renew before expiry will attract a fine."
Then as far as those who go back and forth are concerned, one does not have to worry any more about how many days you are given, because 90 days will be applied as the standard no matter how long you have been here, so in reality as long as you want providing you flit out South before the 90 days are up. So no more 30 days, 15 days, 24 hours in a worst case scenario! Which kind of makes sense given that they are doing away with the white visa slips, otherwise what physical proof do you have about the time you have been granted! Save confusion, 90 days for all, easy to remember, and leaves no margin for error!

Possibly........but if you cross over to the south and return same day it is clear you have not left Cyprus....now as a non TC will you then get 90 days? Or will you be logged accordingly on the computer and possibly be told verbally as you re-enter that you have only been given 15,30 etc days.

Certainly does need clarifying as currently this is going to cause confusion.

jofra · Post by **jofra** » Sun 17 May 2015 8:22 pm

Kavenkoy wrote:
Kanonier wrote:Interesting times ahead, especially if the United Kingdom votes to leave the European Union in the 2017 referendum.
No chance we could not survive like or not we can't go on without the EU .

"...we can't go on without the EU." - my personal opinion also, but -
"No chance..." as in "... if the United Kingdom votes to leave the European Union..." (?)
- following poll predictions (and everything else) in the general election, I don't think anything can be assumed regarding voters now......
...And that frightens me....

And as an afterthought - if Scotland were to declare UDI (NOT unthinkable!), what stance would they take toward EU membership?

scubadubaqueen · Post by **scubadubaqueen** » Mon 18 May 2015 8:43 am

Posh,
Giving anything less than 90 Days without the white visa slip would be unworkable, and besides I sometimes stay over in the RoC and plan to do so more frequently in the future. So having 90 days coming North whenever, will be pretty much the same as an unrestricted "WELCOME" instead of feeling tense or getting the Spanish inquisition at the TC Border. We all spend money here and lots of it on property, schools, cars, shops, restaurants, and some of us even encourage other visitors to come and spend money as well, further adding to the local economy. We should be welcomed rather than driven out! And if the 90 day visa no white slip is correct, that certainly is a confidence boosting measure, and will be welcomed by many.

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